A Minstrel's Guide

[kristle]

Since we don't have one and we have quite a few people levelling Minstrels at the moment, I thought I'd start one. I'll do it in several parts over the next few weeks to make it easier on the eye.

This is mainly for level 60 minstrels. As you level your minstrel up, you will learn a few things about group healing, but it's only when you are healing night after night in groups that you really start to get the hang of the class. So, just keep levelling until you get to 60:)

First up, the minstrel is the premier healing class of LoTRO. There are other healing classes but, sorry guys, no-one out heals a good minstrel. Roll yourself a minstrel and you'll find yourself very much in demand. No group doing a serious instance will go without its healer.

We'll start with what a minstrel is not. If you ever see this in OOC, you will know that someone has no idea of what they're talking about ;D

1. A minstrel is just heal spamming. Uh-uh.
2. All you do is watch morale bars. Nope.
3. Spamming Song of Soothing is what makes a good minstrel. People like to drop in class skills to make their theories sound good. This one is worse than the first two:)

I'll split this into a few parts. First, and by far the most important, is Understanding Threat Generation. Once you *really* understand the dynamics of threat, you have the hard part of healing covered. Watch this space...

[kristle]

An example is the best way to start this.

Everyone has seen a LM root a group of mobs and knows what happens next - all the mobs hit the LM. Doesn't matter if you have the world's best tank standing there, or a hunter with 4million agility getting her bow out. The LM gets it in the neck.

The best way to understand why is to think of threat as a scale from, say, 1 to 10. Before the fight, the LM has 0 threat, like the rest of the group. The moment the LM hits the mobs, the mobs add 1 to the LMs threat.

Ediel roots - 1 threat.

At that point, no-one else has any threat on the now aggroed mobs, so they do what mobs do - hit the person with the highest threat. Welcome to a repair bill LM.

Except the hunter now shoots an arrow at one mob. Hunters generally have higher threat than an LM who has just rooted.

Finnadan - 2 threat.

Ediel now lives to fight another day as all the mobs switch to Finn. But the tank joins in (she's a good tank, we'll talk about bad tanks later ;D). Tanks have 'aggro' or 'threat' skills. The tank shouts noisily at the mobs.

Thrargall - 6 threat

And the tank's now doing his job, and Finn joins Ediel lower down the threat list, and is free from aggro.

That's threat. And now for the bad news. Minstrels' threat when healing is HIGH. In the scheme of things, I'd put minstrels' threat just behind tanks (it varies depending on the fight).

So, Ediel roots, you heal Ediel.

Ediel - 1 threat, Minstrel - 4 threat. You will automatically retreat in 500 seconds.

One more example. Start the fight again (you're dead remember?). Tank runs in and hits a mob. All is good right? Tank has 6 threat and you can start healing. Not necessarily. Threat on the mob the tank is hitting = 6. Threat on the mobs he hasn't hit or shouted at, 1. You heal tank. At this point the mobs hate you - you're healing the guy hitting them. Your threat rockets. Your tank has more threat than you on the mob he is hitting - but not the guys he hasn't hit. The mobs all have you marked as threat = 4, all the mobs except the tank's target (threat = 6) are on you. This is the bad tank scenario and happens too often.

That's threat. Why does it matter? Two reasons.

1. The most important person in a group from the minstrel's perspective is... the minstrel. A dead mins heals no-one and the group is on it's way to a wipe. You have to understand what will happen to you when you heal. Quite often it won't be safe to heal but you have to anyway, but:
+ it's infinitely preferable to heal when you know it won't draw aggro
+ even more subtley, it's preferable to heal when (and who) you know you'll only draw aggro from a few mobs, not most of them
+ that you can priortise your heals where it won't draw aggro, BEFORE healing when you know it will.

2. Understanding everyone's threat level is key to understanding who needs a heal next. Watching bars tells you who needs a heal NOW, understanding threat tells you who will need a heal NEXT, as threat changes and fluctuates during a fight. The difference between a good healer and a bar-watcher is knowing what comes next.

Time is an important factor in threat. A hunter who fires an arrow might go to 2 threat. Next time he fires, 3 threat, and so on. At the start of a fight, a minstrel is VERY vulnerable - as it progresses and the group build up its threat level, much, much less so. leave healing until you know threat has been built up unless you really have to heal. If you have to heal, understand what will happen when you do - understand threat.

Threat is very roughly divided like this.

Tank (usually GRD) - highest threat (if doing job properly). You'll rarely have problems drawing aggro from a tank. But it means that tanks needs LOTS of healing.

Champs - AoE means champs build up threat on lots of mobs. The problem with champs is that usually the threat on the mobs being AoEd is small, but as they have lots of aggro, they need lots of heals. The result is your threat on some of the mobs goes higher than the champs - and they turn on you.

Hunters, Rune keepers and Wardens come next in my book. These are generally not AoE classes and once they have aggro on a mob, they'll keep it - you can heal safely.

Captains - a lower threat class than most people might think given their heals, high morale and heavy armour. They look bad ass but their threat generation is not that strong (they can trait for extra threat I think, but caps are usually a low heal priority).

Lore masters, low threat. The master of no threat is the Burglar. Burgs hardly ever need a heal in balanced groups.

That isn't quite your heal order, but it gives you a good idea of who will have threat, hence aggro, and therefore who you'll need to heal. It isn't your heal order as no fight goes by the numbers. But having an appreciation of the above will keep you alert to who is MOST LIKELY to need a heal next.

A last word on threat, relating to large pulls (i.e. lots of mobs) Mobs who have not been directly attacked still have threat numbers in their little heads. If everyone in the group is on the tank's target, all the mobs will stay on the tank as his threat on their best friend is higher than anyone elses. But when you heal him, they will come after you. This doesn't happen much - champs AoE, hunts do some AoE, burgs have dusted them, capts have healed and so on - and therefore have raised their threat. But there is often - usually - one or two mobs in a large pull where threat is low and your threat will pull them. This is bad news. you can't heal a group when you are being interrupted (or worse, dying). This is when you hear the mins shouting out for help.

That's the basics of threat. It is often the same between fights and you will end up being quite able to predict who will need a heal, and when. Understanding it is the key to good healing.

[Starmeadow]

really really nice guide kris ^^ gonna read again and again when levelling and playing my own little minstrel

You wrote somewhere in there: 'Ediel now lives to fight another day as all the mobs switch to Finn. But the tank joins in (she's a good tank, we'll talk about bad tanks later ;D). Tanks have 'aggro' or 'threat' skills. The tank shouts noisily at the mobs.'

u calling me a tank? or did u call thrar a girl?

[Demonjay]

very very nice kris
this will help a lot of minstrel in understanding and making a good minstrels in groups to come

the whole treat explanation is very wel explained , following those points u mentioned does make u understand the fight better and can make a change as in a dead minstrel or even a minstrel screaming out for help the whole time

thnx for taking the time in putting this up m8
good stuff


o and u are right about the captain we have a lower treat then other classes unless we trait for it but in general we have no aoe and the single mobs we do hit with our halberd (high dps) we do aggro pretty good but in most casses we are vairly save in fight

o and our high moral and heavy armour does make us look bad ass!!

[g3nesisuk]

Great Guide, a very good and well thoughtout post had some nice little tips for me in there.

Even though I have a lot of expierence with MMO's, Aggro/Threat/Hate (Depending on what game) Management and healing (Over 8 years worth of experience playing Main Healer). I am new to the Minstrel class and it's dynamics so I am very eager to see what else you post which will hopefully help me to become a better healer in LotrO

There was only one thing I would like to make note of and that is the below comment:

Jul 9, 2009 21:39:38 GMT -1 @kristle said:

Hunters, Rune keepers and Wardens come next in my book. These are generally not AoE classes and once they have aggro on a mob, they'll keep it - you can heal safely.

Though this is true for the most part, I have highlighted the parts I do not agree with. A Hunter Should always be controlling his/her aggro and can do even running in Strength Stance. I have never had a problem with my aggro or power management on Anyalith (I may grab aggro for say 10 seconds but it will be back to the tank within that period with the help of me)

Like Champions (Post Bk8) we should always be stance dancing e.g. Turtle if you grab aggro pop Beneath Notice (I know most do this) but you can continue to control aggro even while this is on cooldown, Grabbed aggro again? Endurance Stance and Quick Shot is your friend learn to use it. So that this is not completely off topic, my reason for posting is that healing a hunter is a power costly thing for a minstrel in the long run as you are rather squishy and will require more healing in the period your getting beat on than a Tank would. So help yourselfs by helping us.

[finn]

Nice indeed Kris, don't forget to give a beak down on particular trait sets and virtue compositions too. Any tips on LI's for weapons would be advantageous too

Jul 10, 2009 14:23:22 GMT -1 g3nesisuk said:

Like Champions (Post Bk8) we should always be stance dancing e.g. Turtle if you grab aggro pop Beneath Notice (I know most do this) but you can continue to control aggro even while this is on cooldown, Grabbed aggro again? Endurance Stance and Quick Shot is your friend learn to use it. So that this is not completely off topic, my reason for posting is that healing a hunter is a power costly thing for a minstrel in the long run as you are rather squishy and will require more healing in the period your getting beat on than a Tank would. So help yourselfs by helping us.

I have to disagree here Genesis. I have a counter arguement to balance the stance dancing, but this is not the thread for it as it would involve discussing Lore Masters having to dish power to hunters taking away from the fact that the Minstrel is the higher priority for power, then there is the trait sets each stance can be traited for.

Like I say, this thread is a guide for fledgling/less experienced Minstrels and not a place for discussing the pros' or cons' of other classes and their dynamics peculiar to this game.

[kristle]

I can't comment on hunters threat/aggro management:)

The point I'm making is not that you can control/change it, it's that 1) when a hunter has aggro it's unlikely a minstrel will pull it from you, so you can be healed safely and 2) you will get aggro in most fights faster than LMs/Caps/burgs - your relative threat level on my rough scale above.

The scale is only rough - threat/aggro changes from fight to fight, as well as with skills/traits etc. I guess I'm trying to point out that if you are expecting burgs and LMs to need as much healing as hunters, you'd be wrong:)

[kristle]

The last part gave an idea of who you should heal in what order as it discussed the likely threat they put out and therefore the aggro they will receive. Roughly:

GRD
Champs
Hunts, RKs, Wardens
Capts
LMs
Burgs

That's not quite the end. An additional, and obvious factor, is current health.

Sometimes, it is obvious who needs a heal - the guy who is just about to die. However, that situation doesn't happen that often and therefore you have decisions to make.

Tank on 4,000 (say 60% of max morale) or LM on 1,000 health (say 25% of max health)? The simple answer might be LM - closer to dying, right?

But from the above, you'll now know that the tank might actually be your next heal. If the LM has lost aggro, and the tank has it, it may be better to give the tank a quick heal first, and then move to getting the LM back to full health.

Simply put, if you rely on health bars to decide your next heal, you'd be wrong:)

There's no hard and fast rules for this. As a rule of thumb, don't let anyone get below 1,200 health (lvl 60) without a heal (as one big hit might kill them). Use your knowledge of aggro and the state of health bars together to decide who gets heals.

The third factor is role. Obviously, you don't want a dead tank - or tanks if you have more than one. When I say tank it might not be a GRD, it might be a hunter range tanking. Keep your tanks alive. Also, in some (but not many) fights, other classes can't die - think of, say, a champ who must clobber or the fight fails.

Letting people die...

So you have choices to make when healing. One is who to let die. Sometimes, you can't keep the whole group up - too much aggro from a bad pull, or just a crap group.

Again roughly, you let people die in this order 1) people you don't like 2) bad players (why bother keeping them alive) 3) badly equipped players (tanks with 4,000 morale) 4) all classes except capts and tanks 5) capts and last 6) tanks.

You keep captains alive if possible as they can res in combat. You keep your tank alive as long as possible as it might be enough to get you through without a wipe. When I say tank, this might not be a GRD, it could be a hunt or whatever.

[wardo]

Jul 29, 2009 7:51:19 GMT -1 @kristle said:

The last part gave an idea of who you should heal in what order as it discussed the likely threat they put out and therefore the aggro they will receive. Roughly:

GRD
Champs
Hunts, RKs, Wardens
Capts
LMs
Burgs

Ehh ? On my burg I've mananged to pull agro from a lot of these classes by just dps-ing the mobs they had on them, so I'm not convinced your list is in the right order. And if I actually start a fight with a big hit it's hard to get them off me.
Ofc burglars have some tricks up to avoid going down, but that's a different topic (and not this thread-order list).
And shouldn't wardens as tanking class be a bit higher on the list ?

I guess the list also depends on the type of fight. Against single targets (bosses) or group of trash mobs the lists would differ.

Oh and last thought, shouldn't you add a minstrel in this list as well (when you have 2 minstrels or me in a fs or raid)

[kristle]

Burgs do get aggro, ofc. And yes, I'm sure you do pull aggro off other players sometimes. But there is no doubt at all in my mind that the burg is the lowest threat class. Hardly ever needs a heal, hardly ever dies - basically, burgs rarely get into any trouble.

As to wardens, you could be right. Simply, there isn't enough wardens and rune-keepers playing at the moment for me to have enough experience healing them to guess their threat generation.

All players differ in how they play as well - think of the hunters who aren't happy unless they're in Strength stance compared to those who make it their objective to not get aggro. The threat guide (I said above it varies according to fights, traits, players etc - it can only be an average) is based on averages and until I've played with a lot more wrds/rks I really can't say where they fit with any certainty:(

I'm reasonably confident that the above is correct though. Champs AoE just gets them lots of aggro and is often enough to pull mobs easily away from the tank. Hunts do this too, but hunts only usually pull one mob - champs gets lot, hence their higher spot on the list. Same deal with wardens - single targets not aoe, tanking class, not dps, and a tank class who don't (it seems to me) put out as much threat as GRDs. So lower down the list

Minstrels threat is discussed - it comes just behind tanks. Healing another minstrel is not something you do that often (as the mins should be healing him/herself). But when you do, the same dynamic applies - heal the mins more than a few times and the aggro will transfer to you.

But trust me on the burgs:)

[kristle]

I'm not going to talk about all skills as it'd be way too long and boring.

Healing skills

Raise the Spirit ('half heal') and Bolster Courage ('full heal') are your main heal skills. These should be the ones you use most as they are good heals at a low power cost. As they heal single targets, you can predict what your doing to your threat.

Chord of Salvation should be thought of as an emergency heal, or your third heal after RTS and BC. No cast time. Have it standing by. You will need to use it a lot, but always try to use it last, only when you need a quick heal. Always use RTS and BC first. If you can get a cd legacy on your legendary item at 60, go for it - really, really handy. The threat on this heal is similar to RTS and BC so you can control your threat.

Your worst heal by far is Inspire Fellows. Look at the power cost and heal size compared to RTS and BC. Worse though, you heal the whole group - which takes you up the threat list on EVERY mob. Don't use this unless you must. It has its uses, but use it sparingly.

* When minstrels spam this, you'll know they aren't very good:(

Triumphant Spirit. This really is an emergency-only heal. It is a big heal and instant cast so is really helpful, but the threat generation is very large (read the skill description). The cd is long. It should be used well into the fight when everyone has lots of threat and only in an emergency.

Soliloquy of Spirit. Single target HoT. I like this heal a lot. Traited it can heal for around 100 every 3 seconds - in 30 seconds, 1,000 morale. Very flexible - use on a tank as a top-up to main heals, or cast on someone instead of RTS or BC to heal them up. Worth getting the legacy for extra pulse strength if you can.

Fellowships Heart. Uber:) Use to keep a group alive through a tough spot in a fight, or for the last 60 seconds of a fight to make sure you get it done. More or less grants invincibility to the group, such is its strength. Most often used on boss fights - has a very long cd. Heal strength can be increased using Lothlorien jewels - +20% to FH strength is just awesome. (mine crits for over 1,000 a pulse:))

There is also the icmr skill (a tier 4 ballad/song) whose name I forget. Worth using, but not really part of your core heal skills (long cd, strength of heal not that great, works slowly not instantly). Useful, but not one you'll use with the same frequency as your other heal skills. Note though, it generates no threat so is a handy additional 'heal'.

Threat control

Two skills, Ballad of Compassion (tier 3 ballad) and Song of Soothing.

BoC is very handy at the start of a fight. Get off a tier 1 and 2 ballad, hit this and you have -45% threat from heals for 30 seconds - enough to get a few heals in while the group builds aggro without you getting any mobs. This is how I try to start all encounters. You can use Chord of Salvation (opens up all tiered ballads) if you need to be able to cast this in a big pull when the tank takes a beating at the start.

Song of Soothing. This can be traited to be insta-cast. Un-traited, it has a cast time and can be interrupted. I prefer to have it traited. If I then get aggro, I can soothe without any problems (whether it actually loses me aggro depends on my overall threat level - it is NOT a guaranteed way to get mobs off you). However, the cd is longer and it means you don't always have it handy.

Untraited, the cd is quick (might be instant - can't remember). This means you can spam it to reduce your overall threat level. But when you have mobs on you, casting it can be hard as you'll get interrupted.

So you choose: insta-cast to get you out of trouble (hopefully) or no cd so you can spam and keep your threat down. As I said, I prefer insta-cast - but I'm fairly confident in my ability to manage threat during a fight. (I said at the start that spamming this doesn't make a good minstrel. It's not a bad idea at all to spam this - but if you understand threat well enough, you don;'t need to...).

A nice challenge for a minstrel is this. During the fight, think about your threat, and judge if you need to soothe. When you think its needed, cast Song of Soothing. If, a micro-second after you have started casting, a mob runs to you, then runs back away from you as the Song takes effect, then you have judged your threat perfectly. Try it:)

Other Skills

I'm not going to talk about all skills. Most should be obvious. Some that I think are worthy of mention or get overlooked:

Ballad of War - tier 3 ballad - extra 10% melee damage for group. Spam it when you have champs.

Call to Greatness. Insta cast, 5 mins cd. Does different things for different classes. Adds fervour to champs, focus to hunters over time. Grants defeat events to captains (so they can heal). Allows LMs to use their heal more often. I use it mainly on the tank - it lets him spam threat skills more often - and on DPS classes. It mean DPS classes don't need to build focus/fervour - you've just given it to them. Tanks build up threat faster.

Call to the Fellowship. I wish I remembered to use this more often:) Adds 10% (can be raised through legs) to all fellowship skills when cast during a conjunction. The main problem is it is so often wasted by people getting cjs wrong (and is why I don't use it that often). I tend to try to use when there's a burg in the group (so you know when cjs are coming) and the group has shown it can pull off the conjunction.

One last word - tier 1 and 2 buffs or not? You can trait it so your +50 vit and +10% evade ballads apply to the whole group for 30 secs. I'm not a fan personally. 50 vit increases maximum morale - not much use in a fight when morale isn't at max (OK, +vit helps other things too). +10% evade is quite nice though.

I don't use them as it means a class trait slot is used - I prefer to keep mine for other things. You decide.

[opuri]

Aweosome, very nice guide, will come very hadny to my level 13 mins. Total newb to LOTRO so i'm quite unfamiliar with it.

Luckily i'm familiarised with threat level, Guild Wars's are easier to understand *and avoid*
But with practice i'm pretty sure i can become one of those good mins you mentioned

[taurnion]

Thanks for this Kris, just got Meriodas to level 40 so i'll be needing this soon

[Demonjay]

May 27, 2010 9:36:49 GMT -1 taurnion said:

Thanks for this Kris, just got Meriodas to level 40 so i'll be needing this soon